File talk:Harve Bennett.jpg
From MA:IfD Questionable fair use image that has been replaced by a freer image.--Rockfang 09:53, February 7, 2010 (UTC) :Keep. The image is not "questionable fair use" as it's from the motion picture collection DVD set. This source is cited on the image, so there's nothing questionable about it. The one you uploaded, on the other hand, may be questionable: do you have permission to use that image? Did you get permission from the flickr user you cited, or are you that user? In any case, being of "questionable fair use" is not a valid reason to get rid of the old image as it does not apply. --From Andoria with Love 10:30, February 7, 2010 (UTC) My apologies, I should have worded my rationale for deletion better. I'm not questioning the source of the image, or whether or not it is actually Harve Bennett. With regards to "permission", the permission is given and shown on the Flickr image page under the "Additional Information" section on the right side. When you release an image like this, that permission is enough. You don't need a specific request for each use of the image. For example if multiple web sites wanted to use it, they each wouldn't have to ask permission. Keeping that in mind, my "questionable" comment was meant in regards to using a fair use image in place of an image that has a freer license. In fact, if you check out this link, it states that freer images are preferred over fair-use ones.--Rockfang 10:58, February 7, 2010 (UTC) ::Keep. I see no reason to get rid of the image. I don't know enough about the second image, but it seems to be redundant if nothing else.--31dot 11:10, February 7, 2010 (UTC) :::See also this TF thread: Forum:Replacing unfree images. Basically, "fair use" images are as "unfree" as it gets, so they should be replaced with "free" images if it can be done. Here, the two images show the exact same thing, so it definitely should be done (deleting the "fair use" one, or just replacing the image located there). As an aside, though, I'm sure we don't need the new one as a 2.4MB version! -- Cid Highwind 11:28, February 7, 2010 (UTC) ::::Cid: The only problem I have with that logic, is that it means that every single image we have of a production person that is from DVD special features, magazines, etc, must be replaced. The whole point of that forum discussion was to replace the ones where people claimed copyright over their image that they created and uploaded. For the things from the actual production (ie, DVD special features, etc), there is no reason that we should not be using those, and if we do stop using them, then we should get rid of all of the screen shots from episodes too for exactly the same reason. Don't twist the logic of the initial argument in the forum. -- sulfur 13:32, February 7, 2010 (UTC) :::Well... I made the initial argument as well as the only follow-up five days later - so if I'm making the connection now, perhaps it isn't really "twisting" anything, but in fact what I had in mind all the time? :) :::In any case, I stand by the point I made back then - if we have a "free" replacement, we should use it. Bringing up episode screen shots is a non sequitur, because the basic point that can be made there (and actually one we do make by claiming fair use) is that there simply is no free alternative to be used. A free replacement has been found in this case, so what actually is a good reason for not using it? BTW, there wouldn't even have to be a deletion discussion, if the uploader had just uploaded the image to the same filename - something that could still be done, and would be well within our current guidelines. -- Cid Highwind 16:32, February 7, 2010 (UTC) ::::With regards to the 2.4MB size, I apologise. My mind was in Wikimedia Commons mode. I work there a lot more often and there it is preferred to use the highest resolution version. If someone wants to resize the one I uploaded here they are welcome to. On a different note, I decided to upload the image as a separate name because the differences in licenses between the two images. I figured that if someone from outside this site wanted to reuse the image, they might think that all past revisions were under the same license. Which would be incorrect. If I was going to upload a fair-use image over another fair-use image, then I'd use the same name.--Rockfang 21:49, February 7, 2010 (UTC) :I've uploaded the image from the Motion Picture DVD Collection to illustrate the article of Harve Bennett. But I like the new one and think it will fit into the article. When there is no copyright issue with the new image then replace the old one. – Tom 13:14, February 8, 2010 (UTC) Are there any opinions on a final verdict?--Rockfang 14:41, February 24, 2010 (UTC) Do these discussions get closed like on the English Wikipedia? Or does something else happen? Either way, just letting this sit here becoming stagnant without any apparent conclusion seems kinda odd.--Rockfang 08:04, March 6, 2010 (UTC) *Good point, is there going to be a resolution on this? :-) My vote, BTW, would be to delete the non-free image and replace it with the free one in all links--there's no reason not to in this case. -Mdettweiler 16:49, March 19, 2010 (UTC) *I deleted the original image, since this one just replaces it, and it is "freer'" than the other one. - 22:07, March 31, 2010 (UTC)